Help a Reader Out: Potty Training at Night

Stephanie said...

My daughter is now a little over 3 1/2 and has been potty trained during the day since last summer. We officially did away with the diaper at night this past January. She would then wake often at night crying needing to go potty, and I would take her and she'd go back to sleep. This would happen several times a night. She has only wet the bed 2 times since taking away the diaper. I expected her to wake a lot the first couple of weeks while getting used to not having a diaper, but like I said, that was back in January when we started and it's now 8 months later and she is still waking several times a night to go potty. There have been some nights in between there where she's slept all night or only gotten up 1 time (which is such a treat that it's just as good as all night!). But most of the time it's anywhere from 2-5 times a night she's going. And of course I cut her off of liquids at least an hour to an hour and a half before bed, but it doesn't seem to matter because there have been some nights that she has had something to drink right before bed and I thought for sure she was going to be up a lot and then doesn't wake up at all! I'm not sure what's happening first--either she's not sleeping good and even the slightest feeling of having to pee is causing her to get up and go OR she really does have to go and that's what's waking her. I also found out I was pregnant in January and I was nervous about having 2 kids getting up all night, but everyone assured me that this would certainly go away by the time the baby comes. I'm now a little over a week away from having this baby, and it's not ANY better! And it is incredibly exhausting having to get up that many times a night now with being pregnant. But after the baby comes, once one falls asleep, the other is going to wake up--I'm nervous about how that's going to leave my sanity! :) So anyway, I was just wondering if you've experienced this with your kids at all or have heard of other kids. Everyone I talk to who has kids the same age all say their kid doesn't ever wake up once they're asleep. Thanks so much for any help or advice you can give!!!

September 8, 2011 10:36 AM

Plowmanators said...

Stephanie, I haven't experienced that at all. I know some moms take their child to potty right before they go to bed--it is like a "dream pee."

I would wonder if it is some sort of habit. If she still is waking up and you have a new baby, I would honestly put her in a diaper for nights again. If you are getting up all night long between two children, you are going to be unable to function.

If you would like, I can post this as a "help a reader out' question to see if there are some good ideas and experience out there.

September 25, 2011 10:37 PM

Stephanie said...

Sure! I'll take any ideas! Thanks!

September 30, 2011 1:49 AM

Help a Reader Out: Toddler Not Napping

noblesvillemom said...

Hi Val, my DD has been having trouble with naps and bedtime for about a year. She gave up the second nap at about 13 mths (would just play in her crib for 2 hrs, but not nap), and then by about 16 or 17 mths she started taking a long time (1-2 or more hours) to fall asleep at naptime and at bedtime. Of course, I feel like I've tried a million things and at times, it's gotten better, only to get worse, and so on. Now, she will rarely fall asleep on her own at naptime and if she does, she usually takes 2-3 hrs to fall asleep at bedtime (meaning 9:30-10:30 asleep). For a while, she was taking about 3 or four naps a week (falling asleep on her own),, but about 2 weeks ago she went 6 days straight no nap. By the end of it she was waking in the middle of the night and up for 3 hours before falling back asleep. Waking in the MOTN has been yapping for months, but I don't know how often cuz I am not always awake. After that was happening, I was desperate, so the next day I rocked her to sleep at naptime and she was asleep in 10 min and slept for 2 hours. I have done that about 5 other times in the last week and those days she went to sleep, but the others, not. It's not that she isn't tired, but she'll lay quietly for about 5 min and then start singing, pretending, etc until there is no way she'll go to sleep. I've thought about the sleep rules but didn't know if she's old enough. Any ideas of how to help her self-settle (she's done it for her whole life, but seems to not work now)? Or any other suggestions?
Her schedule: if nap
7:30-8: wake
1-3: nap
7:30-8: bed
9:30-10:30: she actually falls asleep
Schedule:no nap
7:30-8: wake
1: lay for nap, but no sleep. Leave in bed til 3ish
6: in bed and asleep in 5 min

So, any advice would be great.
Thx. Laura

February 18, 2011 12:00 PM 

Plowmanators said...

Laura, I really don't know. If she is in bed happy but not going to sleep, I don't know what you could do.

Have you tried going in and telling her to go to sleep?

I can post this as a "help a reader out" question if you would like. Let me know.

March 2, 2011 12:10 PM 

noblesvillemom said...

Thanks, Val. Sure, you could put it as a help a reader out. I have tried going in and telling her to . . Lay down, close eyes, be quiet and go to sleep and have tried punishments too. It seems to help a little, but not consistently. Even though she has not been rocked to sleep in the past, that is what I have been doing recently and she'll be asleep in 5 min of rocking/singing (only for naptime). It's like she is tired, but won't let herself settle down unless u force her (hold and rock her). At least she has been happier and less grumpy since she's been napping more the past few weeks And she has been waking up less at night. Thx again. 

Help A Reader Out: Traveling and Maintaining Schedule

mrs. martin said...

Ok, I need help again, big time! So here it is: we have been having to travel a LOT the past month and it's not even close to being over. The first 2 trips went alright, we were staying in people's homes so I could keep him on schedule pretty well. But this past trip (#3), we were in a totally different time zone for a week and I had to keep him quiet for most of the time, so as you can imagine, he got pretty "snacky" REAL fast, not to mention, very used to being held 24/7! We will not be home more than a week or 2 at a time for the next 3 months and I don't really know what to do. We have 5 days before the next trip and then a week and a half before the next. I'm trying so hard to get him back on schedule somehow but I just don't have any idea where to start!
He is 5 mos. Sleeps through the night perfectly still (the only thing that didn't change), but naps and feedings are all over the place- absolutely no consistency. How do I get him back to normal? Any previous posts on this that might help? As always, thank you SO MUCH for this blog and all your help to us new moms!

Plowmanators said...

This is a hard one.

See the posts on "flexibility"

The best thing to do is maintain your "normal" as much as possible.

Then you have to expect there will be some setback and that you will need to do some retraining once things settle down.

See also the posts on "traveling"

Beyond that, I don't have experience with this exact situation. If you like, I can do this as a "help a reader out" question so you can get input from others who have faced similar circumstances.

mrs. martin said...

Val,
That would be great! It would certainly be helpful to see what others did to train/re-train/maintain some consistency while on the go for extended periods of time. Especially with a lot of switching time zones, it would be great if anyone had experience with that! Fortunately, we were able to keep him on schedule-ish during Thanksgiving because we were in one place the whole time but we will not be so lucky with the rest of the next few months. Oh well, live, learn and be flexible I guess! Thanks for your continued help and advice!

Help A Reader Out: Toddler Crying Before Naps

Hello readers! Please share any experience/insight you have with this situation:

Sum said...

Hi Val - I scanned all of these questions/comments and even the link to Reader Nap Questions, but they all seem to be for babies much younger than mine, so I have to ask my question (sorry in advance for the length) - desperately hoping you can help!

My almost-17mo old (take note--child is now almost 18 months old) son has generally been a great night sleeper. He still cries for 2-5 min when I put him down at night but he does not cry at all when my husband puts him down (though we use the same routine) so we chalk it up to him just liking me better :) and having a harder time separating. Either way, he falls asleep on his own and sleeps all night.

Naptime has never been so easy. He has always been a champion fighter in this case. (Currently at one nap per day - dropped morning nap a few months back, so it's not a dropping issue). Sometimes he has stretches or days where he'll go down without a fight, but it is regular for him to have days where he will cry for awhile before falling asleep. Until 2-3 weeks ago, he would eventually fall asleep, though sometimes after 30+min of crying. Now he has been crying for an entire hour with very little breaks. I am almost 100% sure it is not teething/sickness or anything else - he is totally normal at all other times of the day and at night. So I just let him cry for that hour because I want to keep the principle of naptime and parent-direction sacred. I have to let you know that I work and so our nanny puts him down 4 days a week - but I have told her the rules and she says she abides by them (although the angst of working outside the home is that you never really know if that's what's going on - I really hope that lack of consistency is not what's causing this!).

Anyway, I guess my main questions are - why do I still have a crier?! Is there any chance that he just doesn't need a nap anymore? Am i being too hard on him to let him cry that hour and then just give up on the nap? Today we tried putting books in his crib so he'd have something to do besides cry, and he's still in there screaming... any ideas? THANK YOU for taking the time to answer - I LOVE your blog and appreciate all the time you put into it to help us moms out here!!

October 31, 2010 12:09 PM 

Plowmanators said...

Sum,

Yes, he still needs a nap FOR SURE, so that isn't it.

You know, there are so many angles here I am thinking this might be a good "help a reader out question." I don't have experience with this age group crying before naps, and experience counts for a lot. Would you be okay with me posting this as a question to see if a reader has ideas for you?

November 11, 2010 11:54 AM 

Sum said...

Hey Val - Sorry I just saw your response! I had been checking back regularly but skipped a couple weeks with the Thanksgiving craziness. Yes, I would love for you to share my question with your audience - feel free to paraphrase my ramblings as needed :). A month after my original comment we're still dealing with lots of crying at naptime (but perfection at night, which I am thankful for). Also - fyi, I had a talk with our nanny and she really seems to be consistent in letting him CIO for the nap (plus my husband has been home a lot lately and can vouch for it). Thanks!

November 30, 2010 7:51 AM 

Help a Reader Out: Toddler Prayers

This is a question from Christine:

I have a "help a reader out" question! What are your favorite bedtime prayers for toddlers? 

Since my religion is one that doesn't do memorized prayers for anything but Sacrament, I definitely can be of no help here! So it is up to you readers :)

Help a Reader Out: Pre-Toddler Hitting

Lisa said...

I was happy to see this post because this is something I'm dealing with right now. The only difference, however, is that my son is hitting adults, not kids (at least not yet). So far, he has hit me and my husband as well as my mom (the dog too). He seems to do it when he is frustrated, but sometimes I don't have a clue why he hits.

As far as understanding why he hits and trying to eliminate the reason, I don't know what to do. One example of a time he may hit is when I try to hand him over to daddy. He loves his daddy, but he is on a real mommy kick right now an sometimes will snub daddy. A few times, he has taken it as far as swatting at daddy's face. How can I stop that? I can't just let him have his way and not give him to daddy.

Sometimes he hits for seemingly no reason at all. If I'm holding him and I look at his face and make eye contact for too long, he swats.

Here is the scenario: Right after he hits, our innate reaction is to gently grab his hand away from our face. But, he doesn't always just swat once...he will continually swat and with both hands. So you are trying to protect your face, tell him No and isolate him in the playpen all while he is swatting at your face. In addition, our "reaction" of trying to get him to stop sometimes makes him laugh. He is the kind of baby that loves to get any reaction out of you he can. The more you tell him no, the more he laughs and does things again. That's bad enough when he is pulling on the curtains, but it's really awful with the hitting.

So by the time you get him in the playpen, it feels like so much just happened and you aren't even sure he heard you saying "No we don't hit" let alone understood what you meant and the "hitting" was the action he had just taken. Once in the playpen, he does cry because he doesn't want to be isolated, but I really don't think he realizes that it is because of what he just did. (By the way, he is 16 months old, so the talking to and reasoning with you mention in your post, really won't work here).

I am basically at the end of my rope. This has been going on for a while. We've also tried to teach him "gentle" as well (rubbing his arm or face softly while saying the word.) He just hasn't gotten it.

I would really love some suggestions. Everything you mention in your post sounds good, but none are really relevant to my exact situation. You were able to tell Kaitlyn that as a result of hitting, she no longer was able to play with Brayden. How can I apply such punishment in our situation?

August 12, 2010 10:42 AM 

D & H said...

Lisa, when I worked in a daycare I had a problem with a one-year-old little boy who was hitting another child. You said your boy "is the kind of baby that loves to get any reaction out of you he can." It was the same for this boy. What worked with for him was to watch him when he was playing and give lots of positive attention when he was doing well so he wouldn't need to hit to receive attention from me. I would minimize the attention he gets when he hits as much as possible.

August 12, 2010 11:50 AM 

thesprian said...

Lisa,
My son sounds exactly like yours and we have dealt with it in a similar manner. I always noticed that it was worse if he was over tired or overstimulated. Avoiding the triggers helps but you can't always and they need the opportunity to learn. I would say a firm No, grab his arms and gently rub them on my cheeks (or whoever he was hitting as he sometimes hit his baby brother too) and say gentle several times. He sometimes thought was a fun alternative to hitting but if he didn't comply, he went right to time out. We always used the word time out firmly several times when he was in time out so that he would begin to make that connection and before he got out of time out I would grab his hands and rub them on my face again and say gentle again. I'd also say "are you going to obey?" He's two now and still has some offenses but he immediately shows me gentle and says "Obey". It may take time of consistency.
The problem I am having now is what to do with bedtime discipline issues. Jumping up and down instead of laying down to sleep. He only does this for his naps but I can't put him in timeout before nap, that will only delay naptime!

August 13, 2010 10:38 AM 

Lisa said...

Thanks for the comments. I'm working hard to be consistent and I've taken the advice about the repetition of the words "time out" and also asking "are you going to obey?" when taking him out. I guess time will tell.

August 17, 2010 5:31 PM 

Plowmanators said...

Hi Lisa,

A few ideas:

when you give him to Daddy and he hits Daddy, I would take him back and say, "That is a no. You do not hit." I would then go put him in a playpen to have a time out. Use a timer so if he cries, he sees that the timer, not his crying, gets him out.

Be sure to keep your emotions even. Don't act hurt, mad, or happy. Just be firm but without emotions.

McKenna is 16 months old, and I am positive she would understand that when she hit and went in isolation, it would be because of the hitting.

I would continue to teach him "gently." Do it when he isn't mad. So when you are playing, touch him gently and say, "gently." When he is happily petting the dog, say "gently" and demonstrate gently.

One point on the dog issue, my vet once told me to never discipline a child in front of the dog because you don't want the dog thinking it is okay to get mad at the child--you want the dog to respect the child. I haven't thought much about it, but just thought I would mention it to you. When he hits the dog, I would pick him up and carry him out of the room away from the dog immediately.

I could also post this as a "help a reader out" question if you would like. Let me know if you want me to. If so, I will run it this Saturday.

August 24, 2010 8:42 AM 

Lisa said...

Thanks for the advice. I will also pay attention to not disciplining him in front of the dog. That is actually becoming more and more of a problem everyday (him going after the dog).

It's also okay with me to post this in the "help a reader out" section.

August 24, 2010 11:00 AM 

Commented on: Logical Consequences: Hitting and Biting

Help A Reader Out: Toddler Crying Mid-Nap

Melissa Hunt said...


My son, 21 months, is a BW success story. We've never had any problems. That is, until last week when he started waking up 40 minutes into his nap screaming. He falls asleep with no trouble, but wakes too soon in total hysteria. He doesn't seem to be teething and wakes with a clean diaper. We've employed CIO for over a week now and seen no change in behavior. Can you suggest possible causes. The problem does not present at bedtime. His daily schedule is up at 8:30, nap at 1:30, bed at 7:00.
April 8, 2010 3:05 PM
 
 
 
Plowmanators said...


Melissa, is he verbal enough to talk to about it? I would have to wonder if he is having bad dreams, though it would be strange to have that at naps and not night, I don't think it would be impossible.
If you like, I can pose this as a help a reader out question. There might be people out there who have experienced something similar. Let me know if you would like me to do that.
April 12, 2010 12:40 PM
 
 
 
Melissa Hunt said...


Please do pose it as a help a reader out question. Bad dreams are a possibility, but he's still not speaking, so it's hard to know. My other thought is to try moving his nap up a bit, but it's already pretty early in the day.
As a side note, the new behavior did start about 5 weeks after the birth of our second son.

Thanks!
April 14, 2010 11:54 AM

Logical Consequences Help

Hello everyone! I am planning to do a post on logical consequences per a request from a reader. She wanted to know what my logical conseqences are/would be for specific behaviors.

So, my question to you is this. What behaviors would you like to know about? Leave a comment telling me what behaviors you would like to get logical consequences ideas for. I will then list them all in a post and give my thoughts.

Thanks everyone!

Help A Reader Out: Twins and Room Time

TwinMommy said...

Twin question about room time. My twins are 17 months old and they share a room. I usually give them independent playtime in separate pack-n-plays with both in the same room. Any advice for moving from the pack-n-play to roomtime. I know I can't leave them together yet. Val and twin Moms I'd love to hear your suggestions.

Help A Reader Out...Dropping The Morning Nap

Ajenkstrio said...


Question! (and I hope it doesn't actually take three weeks to answer, but I promise not to wait that long to start tweaking!)

My 20 month old has been reluctant to totally drop to one nap, but I am sure this is why she now wakes up in the night more often, so I am NOT letting her sleep in the morning! However, you suggest that her taking only short naps, even when that is her only one, may be because she is staying up too long.

In this process of dropping the morning nap, what do you do with lunch? I have moved lunch a little earlier than her normal noon-time to get her down for a nap, but what if she is acting tired at 10:30 (or even earlier!)? Would you keep her up for another hour until lunch at 11:30? Would you put her to bed then and hope she doesn't wake up hungry? Would you feed her a snack and have a late lunch whenever she does wake up? I know you have lots of suggestions about trying earlier and later and have read most of your articles about weaning and transitioning but don't see anything about eating in conjunction with figuring out naps. This is the first big transition that has not gone easily for us within a few weeks. Thanks!

debbie
January 19, 2010 12:42 PM

Jennifer said...

Debbie, just a little anecdotal help from me. My daughter is 23 months and we went to one nap at about 18 months. She still acts tired around 10:30 or 11:00 am. However, I know from experience I have to keep her up until 1:00 (used to be 12:30) otherwise she'd only sleep for an hour. I try to give her a snack around 10 am and then we often get out of the house until lunch time around 12 to keep her happy. It's better now, but it was pretty hard to keep her up for a month or two. I hope Valerie will also have some good advice for you.
January 20, 2010 3:03 PM

Ajenkstrio said...

Jennifer, thank you for your help! After only one day of trying to let her nap earlier, we went back to running errands or something until lunch so she could nap around 1 or 1:30. She has begun napping better - 1-1/2 to 2 hours. I am looking forward to hearing more, though, about sleeping all night again! I had thought that the nap transition would help that, but it hasn't. She wakes up at least once nearly every night and has for the last three months - ugh. Today I found the posts about toddler sleep problems and was glad to hear that many other parents have dealt with the same thing. It means we'll all make it through eventually! :) I guess the questions here, to follow up are the following . . . How much sleep do they need at different ages? When she goes to only one nap, and still sleeps the same 11-12 hours at night, is that enough? What else can you do in the night to keep the child from waking the house? What else could help to solve this besides working through the nap transition? I am sure that winter - less active playing time - doesn't help, but I don't know what else to try. We've tried earlier and later bedtimes, letting her cry longer to see if she'll go back to sleep on her own (she doesn't; she just gets really agitated and then bothers the upstairs neighbors and is much harder to calm down to sleep), more or less pajamas/blankets. She has always slept in a dark room, and there isn't much noise at night. I certainly have appreciated all of the help here - from Valerie and other parents!

February 2, 2010 2:47 PM

Plowmanators said...
Debbie,

I would treat dropping the nap as a weaning process. Some days, she might need two. Others, just one.

If she was tired at 10:30, I would put her down for a morning nap--a short one. Maybe 1-1.5 hours. Then I would have lunch and put her down for an afternoon anp around 2 or so depending on when she was tired.

Another option is to take her out of the house so she can be distracted from being tired while her body adjusts to one nap.

I usually give my kids snacks around 10ish when they are down to one nap. That is our one snack of the day because we eat an early dinner.
February 3, 2010 10:57 AM

Plowmanators said...

Debbie,

She should be getting about the same amount of sleep per 24 hours, so if going to one nap dropped daytime sleep, move bedtime up.

Watch for molars that can disrupt nighttime sleep, as well as nightmares.
February 3, 2010 11:00 AM

Plowmanators said...

Also, if you would like, I can post your info as a help a reader out question for more reader input. Let me know.
February 3, 2010 11:00 AM

Ajenkstrio said...

I don't mind. Especially after reading the post and comments about toddler sleep issues, this is a problem for many of us! Do you need more information?

For our part, she now naps most days after lunch for 2 hours. If she wakes up earlier, she will sometimes lie back down. We have had more full nights than interrupted and hope to keep working toward not waking at all in the night. Not perfect, but better! What a transition . . .

debbie
February 10, 2010 6:30 AM

Help Me Out: Toy Recommendations

Okay people. McKenna will be one in a little less than two months, which means it is time for me to start planning out her birthday presents :)

I am planning on getting her some more books because she loves them, I love them, everyone loves them...

I am also thinking I will get her a doll so she will have her own baby doll. And probably a new little stuffed animal.

But beyond that, I am looking for suggestions. What do your little ones from age 12-24 months like? She is tricky to shop for since she is my third child and second girl...I am not opposed to her getting something she isn't quite old enough for yet...she can wait to play with it :)

Thanks everyone!

Help A Reader Out...Twins Sleep Troubles

Tracy seems to be having troubles with her twins in some fashion. As you will read, she had naptime troubles, but good nights. As she has fixed naps, nights have started to be thrown off. Please read and see if you have any advice and/or experiences to offer! Thanks!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Tracy said...


Hi Val, this is the first time I've posted, but I've used your blog as a research tool since my boys were born. I have twin boys who are almost 11 months old. They have never been great nappers and I feel like it is because I am not good at reading their cues and understanding what changes are going on. That being said, they are GREAT nighttime sleepers and always have been. I think I have let that fact allow me to just say "oh well" to the daytime nap routine. People are always telling me that they are just ready to drop a nap or drop a bottle or something, but I know that is not true. I have two questions for you.

1. Do you always nurse or give milk before solids or meals? I'm confused as I feel like I have read some things about saving the milk for afterwards.

2. Neither of my boys ever sleep a consistent (2)1.5-2 hour naps two days in a row. They either won't sleep one of the naps or will only sleep 45 minutes. Then, the other one will either be really, really long or just an hour. I am so confused and just don't know what to do.

Here is there ideal schedule:

7:00 - wake, bottle, breakfast
8:45 - nap
11:00 - bottle, lunch*
1:45 - nap
3:30-4 - bottle, dinner
5:30 - sometimes a small snack and water
6:45-7 - bottle, bath, pj's
7:15 - bed

*Morning is a tough time, because one or both of them is almost always awake when it should be nap time and I feel like it is throwing everything off. They are great with independent play, sibling play, meals, and nights. I do love babywise, your blog, and really want this to work.

January 13, 2010 6:00 PM


Plowmanators said...

Tracy,

1. Yes, during the first year, I give milk before the meal. I did things differently with my two older children after one year. With my oldest, I still did take a full milk feeding before the meal. That was really the only way he would drink what he needed, plus I would hold him and it was the only time of day he would hold still :) With my daughter, I gave her milk with her meal and she drank it all. I am not sure what I will do with McKenna...we will see what her personality is like.

If they don't drink milk during the meal, I give them a sippy of water to have with them so they can have something ot drink.


2-Do your boys nap together in the same room? If so, that could be part of the overall problem. I think most kids sleep best in the day alone. But, I do have a neighbor wtih twins who has her twins still napping together at 18 months old. She puts a fan in there for white noise.

You might try a bit longer of waketime in the morning. Most kids that age can handle 2 hours waketime. If yours can't and you know it, ignore me :) Go with what you know, but most can do 2 hours. Then your afternoon is long...so waketime length might be the problem here.

I think I will post your sleeping question as a help a reader out question. Is that okay? There are lots of moms with twins specifically who might be able to offer some help.

January 27, 2010 12:12 PM



Tracy said...

Thanks for the response Val and yes, please use my sleep question as a help a reader out question.

Since posting this a couple of weeks ago, I started having trouble with the boys taking a really long time (over an hour) to fall asleep in the afternoon and resorted to the yahoo groups page for any thoughts. I took some of the responses and have tried to extend waketime and shorten the morning nap. I borrowed a pack-n-play from my mom and have them nap in separate rooms (which seems to help). I also made the afternoon just a bottle and snack and moved dinner later to eat with us. It seems like the naps are starting to get better (2 good days in a row, at least), but both boys started waking early in the morning (5:15-6:!5 instead of 7:00). I've stuck to the new plan though and it seems like they are starting to do better (6:40 this morning). Below is closer to what we have been doing.

(~6:30 wake)*
7:00 - bottle, breakfast
9:00 - nap (wake after 1:15 if needed)
11:30 - bottle, lunch
1:30/2 - nap
bottle/snack when wake
5:30 - dinner (I'm kind of moving this back closer to 5:00 to try and help with the bedtime bottle and early morning waking)
6:30 - bath, pjs, bottle
7:00 - bedtime*


*The things that are happening now are taking a long time to fall asleep at night and waking early in the morning. I am also a little unsure on the exact nap times as I sometimes have to adjust based on what time they wake in the morning. I would love for the boys to go back to sleeping 11.5-12 predictable hours at night.

Help A Reader Out: 5-8 Month Sleep Disruptions

davidsarah311 said...


I've been reading your blog since my little one was born. (I think she is about the same age as McKenna-my little girl was born April 2nd.) Anyway, I've read everything I could find about 6 month sleep problems. I was just hoping to get your help...

My little girl seems to go through 2 or 3 week cycles. She has a bad night when she wakes up many times-she was awake off & on from 1-5:30 this morning-and then we will deal with a couple of weeks of frequent night wakings. She takes an 8oz. bottle at around 6:30 and gets a 2oz. dreamfeed at 9. I was trying to cut out the dreamfeed, but should I be upping it instead? or is the dreamfeed interfering with night sleep? I don't know how to tell the difference...I'm not feeding her at night when she wakes. I tried to comfort her with the paci last night to make sure that it wasn't hunger. She was soothed, but wanted to play, so I put her back in bed. I do not usually use the paci at night & don't replace it during naps.

Her naps are inconsistent at best-a lot of 45 minute ones with an occasional hour and 15 minutes.

Do you have any ideas what I'm doing wrong?

We have started rice cereal about a week ago, but she doesn't really care for it... :)
October 5, 2009 12:40 PM
Plowmanators said...

davidsarah311, I would wonder if she wakes because of a growth spurt? That is about how often growth spurts are supposed to happen (3-4 weeks). When she does it, I would try feeding her more in the daytime.

I would make sure she isn't cold or something with the weather changing. Brayden and McKenna are both very sensitive to temperature in the room while sleeping.
November 2, 2009 11:24 AM

davidsarah311 said...

Thank you for your ideas. It might have been a growth spurt. I'm dealing with the same thing again right now. I tried to give her extra in her bottle yesterday (she takes 6 oz-3 times & an 8oz. before bed), but she wasn't willing. She was up for 1 1/2 hours last night-I checked her once and she was fine. I eventually went in there to hold her because I wasn't sure what was wrong. I sat in her rocker with her, but she just wanted to play. During the couple of hours that I was holding her, she did drift off a few times but then jerked back awake. Eventually, at 1am, I put her back in bed, she was awake, and I didn't hear a peep out of her until 7am. I don't know what I'm doing wrong. I do know that it's a problem to go in and get her after letting her cry for a while, I just trained her to cry that long, but I don't want to leave her if something is wrong. I guess it could be separation anxiety-she stops crying as soon as I come in the room. She is very clingy throughout the day too. I really wish I could get this right! She puts herself to sleep for naps-she has them at 8:30 & 12:30, about 1:15 a piece. (Lately the morning nap is sometimes 2 hours.) I dropped the late afternoon nap several weeks ago since she started getting up at night again & we thought she might be getting too much sleep. (This is a baby that used to cry in her swing when she was sleepy.)

I need some advice-what am I doing wrong?

It would be helpful if I had my husband's support too, he told me that he was going in her room last night if I didn't. :( I felt like such a bad mom!
December 2, 2009 11:48 AM

Plowmanators said...

davidsarah311, Does she have gas? Is there something that is bothering her that she eats? Does she need a bigger diaper on at night? Have you looked at the nighttime sleep problems post and the Naps: Troubleshooting post? Those both have lots of ideas.
December 15, 2009 11:19 AM

davidsarah311 said...
Yes, I've looked through the nap troubleshoots & I wish I could figure out what it was. She hasn't gotten up again in about a week & a half. I switched her to fleece pajamas, so maybe she was cold! I feel a little silly if that's what it was....we'll see. Thanks for your help!
December 15, 2009 12:46 PM

Plowmanators said...
You might be surprised. Brayden and McKenna are both (still) that sensitive to temperature.

If it doensn't work out, let me know and I will post your question as a "help a reader out" post.
December 17, 2009 3:50 PM

davidsarah311 said...
Unfortunately, it didn't work. She was in a pair of fleece pajamas and a cotton wrap-she didn't feel cold to me, but she was up again last night. I went in to check on her & held her for an hour, but she just wanted to play. I eventually put her back in bed and she went to sleep after another 20 minutes of crying.

She has never really had a gas problem. I'm still introducing foods one a week. She wears the extra protection diapers at night & they don't leak through-I smother her behind in butt paste & vaseline before bed.

I feel so discouraged. We're going out of town for Christmas and I know that it will make things even worse when we get back....
December 17, 2009 6:47 PM

Help A Reader Out: Toddler Sleep Problems

I know I said I was going to do this once a week or so, but I was answering questions today and found this. She has been dealing with the issue for so long, I couldn't see any good reason to wait for Saturday to post it!

Bradysmom and Janelle have similar problems. Here is the background:

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bradysmom said...
I need help! Has anyone else experienced sleep problems at 16-18 months? Brady was ALWAYS an awesome sleeper at night. The only time he's had issues is when he was teething, he would wake an hour early in the morning. But for the past month or so, he's been waking somewhere between 5:30 and 6:30 everyday and not going back to sleep. And the last month I've also heard him throughout the night. At night he'll go right back to sleep, but I hear him wake up with a cry throughout the night.

I have tried changing bed times and that didn't seem to make a difference. His room is pitch black. I know that his diaper had been pretty wet in the morning, but he's already in a size bigger-overnight diaper.

We have had some changes - about a month ago we went to 1 nap a day. 3 months ago we got a new nanny. And 5 months ago I went back to work full time. Although that shouldn't really matter because before I was only off every other Friday.

I really don't know what to do and I am extremely exhausted. One of my friends told me that her pediatrician said to put them on Benedryl for 2 weeks at night and that would solve it. But I don't really agree with that.

So- does anyone have any advice as to what to do? Should we go back to 2 naps a day? Is he not getting enough food during the day? Should I drop his last bottle (he gets at 7:30 before bed). He is 18 months, and goes to bed between 7:30 and 7:50 everyday. He used to wake no earlier than 7:00, but usually at 7:30 sometimes 8:00. Oh, and he's not teething. He's got all his teeth in now - except the 2 yr molars but wouldn't expect him to get those, especially since he was a very late teether.

Please help! ... Thanks for the help!

August 21, 2009 4:40 AM

[Yes, that is the correct date]

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Plowmanators said...
bradysmom,

My guess is that he might need two naps again. It can take some time for the sleep deficit to catch up to him.

If you don't do two naps, I would move bedtime up 1-1.5 hours.

September 5, 2009 9:59 AM

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Janelle said...

bradysmom,
I am in the same boat you are. At around 18 months, my son started taking a while to fall asleep. Then at 19 months he started waking early in the morning. Like your son, mine used to wake up around 7:30 am but now he wakes up at 6:30 crying. I think it might be too late to go back to two naps for us (he's been on only one nap for 3 months) but I'm trying an earlier bed time this week. I guess this really isn't any new advice, I just thought I'd let you know that we are going through similar situations. Good luck with your little one and your full time job!

November 30, 2009 1:11 PM

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bradysmom said...

Janelle - has anything worked for you? We have been dealing with this for so long now I have no idea what to do. Brady is now almost 22 months. It's 6am and I have been awake since 4:20am with him. The thing with Brady is that he goes to be just fine - no matter what time I put him down. I've tried changing bed times. Currently his bed time is 6:45, which my husband thinks is too early. I've tried to go back to 2 naps, but if we put him down in the morning, he rarely ever sleeps in the afternoon. Which then leaves me with a toddler that has been awake from 11am - bed time. I am really just completely stressed and sleep deprived. I'm not enjoying this much because all I do is try to figure this out and stress over it. I really don't know what else to do. We did move about a month ago - so I'm sure that adds to it. Today is Wed, since Monday his nose has been stuffy. But I think he's starting to teeth with his 2 year molars - he takes FOREVER to teeth. and when he's teething his nose gets really, really runny. I just don't know any more. I feel like I've tried everything. I'm sure that all of the lack of sleep is causing this cycle now - and he's not sleeping because he's so over tired.

So this is his "normal" schedule - up at 7, which until he was 10 months old was always 7:30. Eats, independent play time, free play time, structured learning time, coloring time, music time, lunch at 11:30, nap after that at 12:15. I would like to put him down later for his nap, but he can't go that long. So he usually wakes up from his nap between 2:30 and 3:15. Then we get ready for bed around 6:20 and he's asleep no later than 7.

So - do I need to change his schedule around? I just don't know what to do. The pediatrician isn't any help.

By the way - if anyone out there lives in Maryland and has suggestions for a pediatrician let me know.

I'm completely at a loss, and this has been going on for so long that I'm so frustrated and upset that I can't figure it out and get it under control. This coming from a baby that we never had night time issues with!

December 2, 2009 4:10 AM

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Janelle said...

bradysmom,
Unfortunately we haven't found anything that really works yet. My son is also teething and this might be causing the problems. We did let him CIO one morning when he work before 6:00am He cried for about 20 mins. then stopped crying but never went back to sleep. He just laid there. (We have a video monitor so I could see that he was awake) Your schedule looks a lot like mine. Logan is in his crib for his nap by 12:30 and is almost always awake by 2:30. Then bedtime is at 7:00. Letting him CIO that one morning did help a little because he is now sleeping until around 6:30am. It's just frustrating because no matter what time I put him to bed at night, he always lays awake in his crib for about an hour. So even if he is in bed by 7:00pm he doesn't go to sleep until 8:00pm. But he's not talking to himself or playing with anything. He is just tossing and turning so going in to him would be a bad idea. I wish I had more suggestions for you, but I don't. Just know that you are not alone!

Maybe Val will have some more ideas for us!

December 2, 2009 1:14 PM

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Plowmanators said...

Bradysmom and Janelle,

I am posting your questions for the next "help a reader out" segment.

Some things to consider are the basic...hot or cold? Do you need to dress them differently at night? Is there some noise waking them? White noise might help.

Teething can do it as can moving--and those 2 year molars take forever (Kaitlyn has literally been getting them in constantly since the end of August).

Hopefully some readers will have some experience/advice for you!

December 14, 2009 9:12 PM

Help A Reader Out: Extended Crying Before Naps

Rebecca asked*:

I have a rather long-winded question for you. We started Babywise with my daughter when she was 6 weeks old (CIO included). She is now almost 12 months old and STILL has to CIO before naps.

She was not a 'textbook' babe when we first started CIO; she would have cried for hours had we let her. My husband and I have been very consistent with her feedings & waketimes because I feel it is important to do CIO responsibly.

For a while (maybe 4-8mo of age) it seemed a little better; she would only cry 10-15min or so when we laid her down. But the past 3 months have been tough--she will talk/fuss/cry for an hour or more at times.

I lay her down for naps at the same time every day, and bedtime is the same also (bedtime is the only time she doesn't CIO; just goes right to sleep).

Do you have any suggestions? We have tried troubleshooting everything; waketime lengths, etc, but it is so frustrating. I would greatly appreciate any insight or advice. I know she might just be a baby who needs to 'blow off steam' before naps, but for more than an hour? Ack!!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

*I broke it up into paragraphs.

Please share your thoughts and experiences on this topic! Thanks everyone!

Help a Reader Out

I have a friend who writes a popular exercise blog. She has a series called "help a reader out" where she posts a question from a reader and asks the blog readers to help answer it. I thought that sounded like a helpful series! I can answer many questions, but there are always those topics that I have no experience with. So every so often on Saturdays, I will post a question I had that week that I just don't really know the answer to. Please add your thoughts! Thanks everyone!

Help A Reader Out Series Index

• Help A Reader Out Series Intro
• Help A Reader Out: 5-8 Month Sleep Disruptions
• Help A Reader Out...Dropping The Morning Nap: http://www.babywisemom.com/2010/03/help-reader-outdropping-morning-nap.html  
• Help A Reader Out: Extended Crying Before Naps
• Help a Reader Out: Potty Training at Night
• Help A Reader Out: Pre-Toddler Hitting
• Help A Reader Out: Toddler Crying Before Naps
• Help A Reader Out: Toddler Crying Mid-Nap: http://www.babywisemom.com/2010/04/help-reader-out-toddler-crying-mid-nap.html
• Help a Reader Out: Toddler Not Napping
• Help a Reader Out: Toddler Prayers
• Help A Reader Out: Toddler Sleep Problems
• Help A Reader Out: Traveling and Maintaining a Schedule: http://www.babywisemom.com/2010/12/help-reader-out-traveling-and.html
• Help A Reader Out: Twins and Roomtime
• Help A Reader Out: Twins Sleep Troubles